How DOOM became DUSK
How DOOM became DUSK


If there is one consistent, overriding complaint
that unites PC, Console, handheld and tabletop gamers, it’s one simple idea- man, remember
the good old days when games didn’t all suck? True or not, it’s a pretty common sentiment,
and we’ve got no shortage of games that claim to be follow ups or spiritual successors
to a variety of landmark titles from days gone by. These kinds of games, which for ease I’m
going to call successors, present a really interesting design challenge. That’s because
they occupy this weird middle ground where they aren’t direct or usually even official
continuations of an idea, but their entire design is consciously inspired by a single
game. You end up caught between the varied and fickle tastes of the general gaming public,
and why people liked the original to begin with. If you make a successor and don’t change
enough, you’ll end up like Yooka Laylee, which, for all its highpoints, is pretty much
just banjo kazooie but with none of the old school charm that makes us forgive its wonky
controls, irritating side characters and nonexistent sense of pacing. Yooka Laylee isn’t a bad
game- I mean- it’s not a good game either but its held back even more by this sense
that… it’s an imitator, that it has very few unique ideas of its own- and that we really
could just be playing the original. Similarly, if you change too much, you’ll
risk alienating longtime fans, and isolating new players from the original, robbing them
of that precious context. Deus Ex is a really telling example of this. The original game
was this intricate, explicitly political and very complex game that took multiple playthroughs
to truly master. The newer deus ex games on the other hand, though still enjoyable, never
really live up to the legacy of the original, trading cutting commentary for third person
shooter action. Fans of J.C. Denton thought the new games were simplistic and safe, but
people who were introduced to deus ex through adam jensen couldn’t get into the uncompromising
and clunky original. The difficulty with successors, is that they’re
simultaneously their own thing, and are inexorably shacked to their inspiration. So the question I want to ask you, is how
do we balance these two elements in order to make a successor that occupies past, present
and future all at the same time? Well, if you ask me, it’s all about grafting,
you know like how you cut a bit off of a plant and then grow it into a whole new one- trust
me it’ll make sense. I think to make a great successor you’ve got to find what part of
the original game you like, and make that the focus, rather than just copying the original
wholesale or ignoring it completely. For example, you’d be stupid to make a successor to mario
without adapting his bouncy, expressive jumps, and you’re probably not going to be able
to follow up on what makes starcraft good without some good old fashioned asymmetrical
balance. The question you’ve got to ask is whether that special bit you want to replicate
is part of the mechanical nuts and bolts of your inspiration, or if it’s something that’s
harder to pin down, and is more about the way you feel when playing rather than any
particular system. Sonic mania is a great example of a successor
that takes already-great mechanics, but uses them in a different, better way. Sonic has
all his old tricks from the genesis era: spindashing, bouncing and running really fast, but they’re
used in all new levels that are much better put together. See, the old sonic games had
a bit of an identity crisis, the blue blur seems like a character built for speedy edge
of your seat platforming action, but too often sega bogs you down with slow-paced obstacle
courses that have a lot of waiting around, and even more… of this. Yeah, early sonic
was not great- but mania ditches all that to give those old mechanics the space they
need to shine, in fast-paced, intricately interwoven platforming challenges that balance
visual spectacle with speedrunning potential. On the other side of the coin, we’ve got
games that try to capture the feeling and the psychological experience of older games,
whilst modernising the mechanics- XCOM would be a great example of this -look I’ve not
mentioned it in ages, gimme a pass here- . The original DOS games and the rebooted firaxis
series play completely differently, but despite this, they both tap into that brilliant feeling
of knife’s edge strategy, where hours of work is constantly on the line, and the aliens
are more often than not always one step ahead. Both of these methodologies are a different
approach at the same thing, selectively nurturing just one element or feeling from the original
game to become the heart of the successor. Part of the game is recognisable, and the
rest is entirely new. It’s not just whole new games that can be
successors either, mods and custom game modes can fill the same role. Vox populi turns civilisation
5 from a casual 4x into a deeply strategic and in depth game and custom levels in golf
with your friends can turn the game from a multiplayer torture simulator into an actual,
functioning golf game, who would have thought? I think the best way of demonstrating this
phenomena in action, is to look at a game that’s 25 years old, but is still clearly
visible as part of its successors in the present day, I’m talking of course, about DOOM.
Doom is a fantastic way of showing not just how a variety of successors can be created
from the same source, but also to demonstrate how in remaking and responding to games we
can help people to appreciate what made the classics great in the first place. There’s a reason why the gaming communities
love for DOOM has endured for so long, it engages with the brutally satisfying and cathartic
human urge for violence. Whether it’s mowing down dozens of zombie soldiers or unloading
a volley of shotgun blasts into the face of a big scary demon, doom revels in its viscerality.
But despite the flair, it’s still manages to wring a lot of strategic depth out of the
relatively simplistic weapon and enemy designs by varying effective ranges, projectile speeds
and the shape of each arena. The end result is an adrenaline-pounding experience that
demands 100% of your attention as you duck and weave between fireballs, advancing on
your prey through mounds of their fallen comrades. Needless to say, Doom is great, and pretty
much holds up today- but we’re not looking at doom, we’re looking at some of the games
it inspired, for example, DUSK. From looking at it, DUSK appears to be very
similar to DOOM, it’s got the same sort of fast paced horde combat, it has this very
cute fake DOS aesthetic and it copies most of the weapons – they even sort of sound the
same. However, despite replicating the form of Doom, Dusk is actually a substantially
different game. For one, Dusk leans way further into the horror
aesthetic than DOOM, which never really goes beyond campy gore. Dusk loves psyching you
out with levels in total darkness, bad guys that jump out of hidden areas, and enemies
like the utterly terrifying wendigos which are invisible and leave a trail of blood or
these chaotic, thrashing demon dog car monstrosities- I don’t even know where to start with that. In addition, the game also cheats in a few
upgrades to the formula that simply weren’t possible in 1993. Advanced scripting lets
enemies teleport in around you and can change entire levels around. Cool but graphically
on theme lighting makes certain enemies harder to spot, and really ramps up the tension in
levels like the Infernal machine. There’s also the crucial addition of a proper Y axis,
meaning that enemies don’t just attack you from the front, sides and behind- they can
also get you from above and below- requiring much more tactical awareness as you fight
across rooms with multiple levels and enemies capable of flight, unlike the kinda head level
hovering the cacodemons did. This focus on fear and surprise means that
dusk often plays much more defensively than its predecessor, with less hitstun and more
angles to be attacked from, a lot of your time in dusk is spent strafing around enemies
or ducking behind corners, particularly in the later levels. Despite playing like doom,
Dusk feels very different, and vice versa with another game that’s a successor to
id software’s opus. Doom. No not doom, doom. Yes, doom. No doom. Honestly what’s so hard
to get about this, it’s doom not doom. okay? The 2016 reboot of the doom franchise henceforth
called doom 2016 obviously takes inspiration from the original game, but the two actually
share relatively little common ground mechanically. Doom 2016’s gunplay is much more complex,
with guns having upgrade paths and alternate fire modes- that’s not including a whole
new melee system called glory kills. The glory kill system underpins pretty much
the entirety of Doom 2016’s gameplay loop, even though it’s totally absent from the
original game. In 2016, guns hold relatively little ammo, and your health depletes very
quickly on even normal difficulty. The only reliable way to regain health and ammo mid
combat is to stun an enemy and glory kill them, releasing a shower of goodies and rendering
you invulnerable in the process. Doom wants you running from glory kill to glory kill
as your health and ammo totals bounce back and forth constantly, forever riding that
thin line between survival and defeat. Where DUSK prefers you fight at mid range whilst
strafing around, DOOM 2016 shines in moment to moment close quarters combat just like
is predecessor, despite playing very differently Doom 2016 distills the legacy of the series
down into white knuckle smash and burn adrenaline, each fight passing in a blood-filled blur
as you bounce from enemy to enemy, tearing your way through them. It feels like the kind
of game the original doom really wanted to be, and taps into that same brutal simplicity-
just with an extra 25 years of design knowledge at tech behind it. And that’s what rebooting games is all about.
The familiar and comfortable working in unison with the new and exciting. It’s a different
way to experience something we love, without just endlessly repeating the same thing over
and over again. Doom struck a cultural chord, it’s no wonder people still want to play
it, but also understandable why people don’t want to muck about with emulators to get it
working on modern systems, or want something with a bit more of a story, or slightly deeper
gunplay. In a video I made about dawn of war in april
of last year, I talked about something called a core experience, the one indivisible part
of a game that makes it special- and that’s really what we’re trying to find here. We’re
working out whether our favourite part of, say, doom is the aesthetic, the mechanics,
the feeling we get when playing it, or even just a single gimmick, and then making something
new to pay homage to and to better facilitate exactly that. Whilst it might appear that the things I’ve
been talking about really only have relevance to developers, figuring out the why we love
particular games can not only help us appreciate them, but also to find successors which might
do the things we love even better. Wargroove is a great example of this idea.
Whilst it looks and plays almost identically to Advance wars, it’s made several key changes
to the formula to cater to a very different style of play. Advance wars is a game all
about long term strategy, games are won by inching forward artillery positions, keeping
your supply lines up, and capturing key strategic locations in order to get the advantage in
the long run, it’s a game where both wins and losses happen very slowly. However, wargroove ditches passive commander
abilities to make them actual units with localised, immediate effects that can change the course
of a skirmish. Commander abilities work alongside criticals, a means through which units can
gain extra power, usually when attacking. This is stuff like if your cavalry has charged
a certain distance or the enemy is surrounded by doggos, it swings control of the game overwhelmingly
in favour of the aggressor, with battles transforming into back and forth bloodbaths where every
unit counts, particularly your powerful commander, who’s quite prone to dying out of nowhere,
losing you the game. Using the mechanical underpinning of Advance
wars, Wargroove changes the focus to small, impactful skirmishes you’d normally only
find in the early game, and makes them the entire experience, focusing on the micro tactics
where advance wars emphasises macro strategy. Another example would be the kickstarter game
One Step from Eden, which takes the slow paced, light tactics of megaman battle network and
gives it a roguelike makeover. It massively upsthe difficulty, turns the speed up to 100
and in doing so gives now grown up fans of MMBN an appropriate challenge that can be
enjoyed in much smaller bursts. The actual gameplay experience is surprisingly similar,
it’s just that the mechanics have been switched up to be less about standing still and shooting
lemons, and more about… this. Full disclosure the person who made this watches
my videos so I can’t guarantee they’re good at making games. Games are continually evolving, and whilst
it’s fine to return to an old favourite every once in awhile or to follow a fun trend,
we can never lose sight of why we enjoy the games we make and play in the first place.
Playing more games and learning to appreciate the artform not only provides a bunch of new
experiences, but allows us to better understand why we love our favourites- and chances are,
someone else will have felt the same way. Dusk caters to horror fans who want hard as
nails tactical gunfights and DOOM 2016 offers an injection of brutal catharsis and the simple
gory fun of the original. Both things provided by doom, but with their full potential realised
in its successors. Which successor to doom do I prefer? Well,
it’s obviously the mod that turns the entire game into the set of hit 90’s sitcom Seinfeld.
This is for the bee movie, Jerry. Hello! And thanks for watching a video that
does, TO BE CLEAR, not endorse the murder of aging comedians, okay? Just want to cover
myself there. Apologies for the late vid, but between taking
a bit of a break and the 100k celebrations, this is the earliest I could get things done. If you’d like to finance the creation of
future videos that will probably happen more regularly, then why don’t you support me
on Patreon, much like these fantastic people you can see on the side of the screen as well
aaaasss: Alex Deloach
Aseran Auno94
Baxter Heal Brian Notarianni
Daniel Mettjes Derk-Jan Karrenbeld
Feetsalot Ivar Olofsson
Jessie Rine Jonathan Kristensen
Joshua Binswanger Leit2
Lucas Slack LunarEagle1996
Macewindow54 Patrick Rhomberg
ReysDad Samuel VanDer Plaats
Strategia in Ultima Chao Thank you all for the recent swell in support-
it means a lot. Before I go I’ve been asked by an anonymous patron to tell you all that
chess is bad and go is better. To that person, I say, give me my five dollars- and to the
rest of you I say, seeya!

89 thoughts on “How DOOM became DUSK”

  1. DR4G0N says:

    Doom 2016 ? You mean DOOM 4?

  2. Lord Tony says:

    I'm going to save some people some time here.

    He doesn't actually start talking about DOOM/DUSK until 4:37 anything before that is literally about random ass games that have absolutely nothing to do with DOOM/DUSK other than being old.

    Between 4:37 to 9:38 he tries comparing DUSK to DOOM graphically and mechanically even though DUSK literally looks and plays like Quake 1 and then there is random commentary about how DOOM 2016 is different from DOOM like we already didn't know.

    And then from 9:38 to 12:14 he talks about random ass games again that are not related to DUSK/DOOM

    and then 12:30 he talks about some stupid seinfield mod.

    I didn't learn a single thing from this video.

  3. Lord Terra says:

    Why didn't you mention that Brutal Doom is what inspired Doom 2016?

  4. MasterDethronerX2 says:

    7:24 "Time only moves when you move"

    S U P E R
    H O T
    S U P E R
    H O T
    S U P E R
    H O T

  5. Mr. weasel says:

    I remember playing a few levels of dusk when it was on itch.io it was ok but now that I see it on steam I'm glad it was finished cause the new 3d doom games while not bad I think is a little boring

  6. Arnis Kalnins says:

    What's the game at 0:30?

  7. SireSquish says:

    08:15 "Even though [glory kills are] totally absent in the original game". I disagree, glory kills and insane levels of violence definitely are in the original game, because brutal doom is so good that it's unofficially canon (says me).

  8. Dayashankar Parlikar says:

    Actually dusk is more like quake than doom

  9. Tac_Reso says:

    I think if you want a "doom" like game to talk about too, you got to bring up the recent title, " Project Warlock" It's really an amazing game !

  10. Christians For Pewdiepie says:

    I just got a Pewdiepie ad.
    I feel blessed…

  11. learrus says:

    Dusk is obviously Blood

  12. Jacob Mac Donald says:

    I've just found your channel and I have really been enjoying your videos. I'm looking forward to watching what you post next and going through your older content

  13. Hunter Van Cleve says:

    Advanced wars was so dope when I first saw it

  14. UltraMeep!!!! says:

    Doom is 27 yrs old -_-

  15. AKK Media says:

    How to make a proper successor: Doom 2016

  16. MED FEZZZ says:

    (not how u spell successors)

  17. Snurky says:

    when you said DaySX i thought you said gaysx

  18. SWOTUS says:

    Great video with many great points! However, there are two blaring mistakes: Dusk was more of a successor to Quake, and Doom 2016 was more of a successor to Brutal Doom.

  19. Maurice Raat says:

    Love your videos Adam. Also thanks for making me aware some one actually made a game inspired by the MMBN combat. But ehhmm… how fucking fast and difficult is this "One step from Eden"?? Imo MMBN was already pretty damn fast and difficult, maybe 1 wasn't that hard, but they made sure to correct that mistake at 2 ( and a bit tuned down forward ). Just to examplify, once you master the MMBN combat most fights won't take much more then 30-60 seconds. ( that's pretty quick imo )

  20. Eppiox says:

    god dam I hated those glory kills

  21. Daniel Bellcaster says:

    НГЕЬ

  22. YouTube God says:

    never played Yooka Laylee because the company chose to pick politics over making a game.

  23. Sir Leviatan Doom says:

    Doom 2016 is a polished copy of Brutal Doom, and that FOV make me bleed my eyes, dude.

  24. dashrendar99 says:

    Sucsessors? Have you ever used a spell-check before? I mean it is 2019 now.

  25. Winchester says:

    Dusk isn't really doom tho it's much closer to quake and blood

  26. KarolaTea says:

    I watched this video at time of night… not lovely 🙁

  27. H.P Alternativeproduction says:

    DUSK ep 3 is probably the most original and refreshing gaming experience I ever had I think.

    I’m just saying some stuff in ep 3 where never done in any other game
    And some that were dusk did it so much better it’s crazy!

    When I was at the level near the end I just thought to myself how crazy that arena is…
    And when I thought about it I understood that in terms of action it puts doom and quake to shame…

  28. Paul Henry says:

    Doom (1993) DOOM (2016) v
    Ö

  29. Cosmic Landscape says:

    Bs the only thing better was that there was less greed

  30. Cosmic Landscape says:

    Core needs to stay the same

  31. Saltseeker says:

    0:12 allow me to hurl and stain this carpet

  32. Rpkiller says:

    Dusk still looks creepy for a old game

  33. Hydroact says:

    What was the game at 0:28

  34. Mace 2.0 says:

    Actually, the game is more or less a spiritual successor to Quake… More specifically, Quake 1 with the fully 3D, along with other games like Hexen & Blood into the mix.

  35. MrAverageCookie says:

    Dusk is by far one of the best first person action shooters I’ve ever played.

  36. Rian Gould says:

    DOOM vr

  37. Guerilla PSYOPS says:

    Doom sucks now.

  38. Skiddzie says:

    isn't this just quake?

  39. Acidhog Alpha says:

    Have you heard of quake? it will same you alot of time 🙂

  40. The Open Rift says:

    I understand from another comment thread that you cut a chunk of the video out talking about Quake, but it's such a crucial thing to miss. Dusk is similar to Quake aesthetically and mechanically. The strafe mechanics are straight out of QuakeWorld, and it's style is vaguely Lovecraftian, laced with themes of the occult and an aesthetic that feels less sci-fi and more ancient, something beyond the terror of hell itself. The weapons round out a bit more like Quake as well, minus the Thunderbolt/Lightning Gun. That isn't to say Doom didn't have influence, of course, but Quake's DNA is still far more dominant.

  41. brainwarts says:

    When talking about how the commanders work in Wargroove versus Advance Wars you missed that the final Advance Wars game, Days of Ruin, uses a system where commanders are deployed with units and their abilities have an effect surrounding them.

  42. jpfan1992 says:

    why could I hear the doom tracks wow my ears must be getting worse

  43. mish says:

    dusk is at 5:50 btw

  44. Xander French says:

    Ah Doom 2016.. My favorite game of all time.

  45. Chloe Pechlaner says:

    As someone who adores both modern and OG Deus Ex, I think people dramatically understate the political commentary of the newer games and overstate the often clumsy commentary of the original.

    I mean, yes, it isnt as much of an immersive sim (although that dialogue system is GOLD), but we have PREY for that, I guess.

  46. Ass Blaster says:

    Who's ready for doom eternal

  47. clueso says:

    I just wanna say that I really like your content!
    That was all atm. Keep going!

  48. Duaij Al-Qallaf says:

    Sucsessors

  49. Chooch Factor says:

    You talked about Doom and Dusk for about 3 minutes in a 14 minute video.

  50. Dav says:

    Dusk >>>>>>>> Doom 2016

  51. fvckyoumate says:

    Dusk is more inspired by quake though.

  52. Elias Laurell says:

    What emulators? don't you know about source ports?

  53. Ash Blossom says:

    Quake: am I a joke to you?

  54. baylego says:

    Dusk inspired by DooM? You sure, have you played Quake?

  55. Saber Goli says:

    its not like doom at all. its like quake

  56. hammaslanka69 says:

    Dusk is nothing like Doom. It looks like cheap garbage. What you describe as terrifying monsters look to me like idiotic caricatures of children's toys. The sprites of Doom are timeless in their aesthetic, whereas the 3D vomit-inducing horseshit is obsolete in a year.

  57. Alex Martinelli says:

    7:24

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  58. XCATX25 says:

    Even if overall the discussion made sense, you talked about these games very deeply but proved that you don't know much about them. The analysis it's full of mistakes that I would define as rookie mistakes. Play more of these games, especially the Doom ones, and recheck your analysis, and you'll see.

  59. Praise The Grape Soda says:

    I didn't even know one step from eden was a thing! I loved mmbn series, this game totally flew under my radar

  60. Mista Wells says:

    a bit annoying how despite dusk having more in common with the original quake, then doom, (both in terms of mood, design and, gameplay) there is no mention of quake in this entire video.

  61. Jack Mooney says:

    does anybody know the game at 0:41

  62. Shovelsson Music says:

    Isn't Dusk based on Quake and Blood?

  63. Fearsome Warrior says:

    It’s totally not Dusk but seeing the comparison reminds me of the game Painkiller. Another flavor of FPS somewhere between many games with a little lean towards Serious Sam. Great video!

  64. J I Joe says:

    gloryhole kills))

  65. Nope 09 says:

    2:16 You wouldn’t graph a tree

  66. Mister Turk Turkle says:

    Um…. no doom is still doom?

  67. Gasmask Mcgee [Carl] says:

    Hello.

  68. Ember D-L says:

    Doom 2016 is actually spelt and pronounced DEUM. The cover is just a misspelling.

  69. KalashniBen says:

    Doggos are good at inspiring

  70. jhjkhgjhfgjg jgjyfhdhbfjhg says:

    Doom 2016 is more inspired by mods to the original Doom, like Brutal Doom or Project Brutality.

  71. DOnGlesS b0ne says:

    But it didn't lol

  72. EvilNecroid says:

    2:21 whats that from?

  73. Ymmat in the hat says:

    why did it take 6minutes to actually talk about the topic lol

  74. 親指 says:

    You spelled Successors wrong at like 0:28 ish

  75. Gamescommentary says:

    How does it take 6 or 7 minutes to get to the point? My God. Also, misleading click bait title. Title should be How Doom Became Brutal Doom. Watched the whole video btw.

  76. Doom58 says:

    Dusk is more quake not doom reupload the video

  77. Johnny DiLelio says:

    A fuckin Seinfeld mod?!?!!

  78. chinitosoccer1 says:

    I rather play Painkiller instead of Dusk whose art direction is plain baaad…

  79. snake698 says:

    But Doom 2016 would be a brutal doom successor… Should've talked about brutal doom
    EDIT: By the way, Axiom Verge and The Messenger must be included in this discussion too, they're godlike.

  80. Tree Sparks says:

    5 minutes into this damn video and it’s still not about doom or dusk. Jeebus man

  81. Marcos Danilo says:

    "how doom turned into dusk", well, it probably fell into a trashcan, that caught fire, died, was ressurrected, turned into a cyborg, died again due to bad wiring, and then was cloned…

  82. Lemonov says:

    And not a single mention of Brutal Doom?

  83. Create -Space says:

    https://blog.naver.com/7heppy7
    We made it well.
    (WOW)

  84. Crab King says:

    8:24 I paused the video here. Lol.

  85. Máté Antal says:

    Did you talk about succesors and Banjo-Kazooie and say the word nuts and bolts without talking about Banjo-Kazooie: Nuts and Bolts?

  86. Auraspeed says:

    I’m just curious do you have a background in Game Design or are just passionate about it? Either way I’m glad to have found the channel and keep up the good work

  87. Kyle Mac says:

    People, turn off filtered textures on your source port!

  88. Xune says:

    Kind of like how Xenonauts and XCOM were reimaginings of X-Com. Xenonauts was the gritty rework for fans of the original while XCOM was a friendlier game for the modern audience.

  89. Create -Space says:

    We made it well.
    https://blog.naver.com/7heppy7

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